A Question About Wired Networking.

cos I don't know what the frack I'm doing

By on March 25, 2013 5:05:10 PM from WinCustomize Forums WinCustomize Forums External Link

starkers

Join Date 05/2004
+938

Okay, so my line in and router is downstairs where our main PCs are, and I want to connect various devices to a wired connection upstairs. Thing is, networking is not my thing and I'm not sure how to go about it.  I did a search and got a whole lot of gobbledygook I could make neither head nor tail of...and pages of sites wanting to sell me shit.  Maybe I wasn't asking the right questions.

Anyway, I have an ethernet cable running from the router to upstairs and a net enabled media player is connected to it thus far.  However, I want to be able to connect the TV, Bluray player, PVR, 2 PC's and the media player all at once.  Now I read something about each device having its own IP address and needing its own ethernet cable to function properly, so can I use a multi-port network switch [see link] at the end of the existing cable to connect the additional devices without confusing/jumbling the signals?

From what I've read it seems so, but I'm not sure. I also read something about using another router as an access point, but that seems rather more complicated and I'm confuseded enough already.

Here's some info regarding the network switch....

Overview

The FS600 Series delivers maximum performance to your home network

  • Links up to 5 or 8 PCs or peripherals to your Ethernet network
  • Connects network devices at 10 or 100 Mbps
  • Plug-and-play installation delivers ease of use
  • Silently runs without a fan

Features

  • 5- or 8-port Fast Ethernet switch instantly expands your network
  • Link up to 5 or 8 PC or Ethernet devices with a fast, auto-switching Ethernet connection
  • Supports Windows® and Macintosh® platforms at speeds of up to 10 or 100 Mbps over Ethernet cables†
  • Every port automatically senses the right speed and full/half duplex mode
  • AutoUplink™ technology adjusts for two major types of connection cables
  • Embedded plug-and-play technology—simply turn it on and it works
  • Sleek, compact design

Key Applications

  • Multiple PCs connecting to the Internet
  • Multiple applications running simultaneously—downloads, voice, music, VoIP
  • Multiplayer gaming over the home network
  • Multimedia/video streaming within the home
  • Networked or shared storage/large file sharing.

 

Hopefully that info helps... and TIA for all and any help offered.

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March 25, 2013 5:55:39 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

starkers, YES you CAN use a hub/switch at the end of a long lead(max 90 METRES)(total cable length for cat5/6/7 is 100 metres by specification), and it is even possible to cascade hubs/switches  if you run out of ports.

I have a shorter version of what you are wanting to do in use in my workshop.

harpo

 

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March 25, 2013 6:17:56 PM from WinCustomize Forums WinCustomize Forums

Thanks mate, I wasn't too sure about connecting multiple devices after reading about IP addresses for everything and crossed signals, etc.... and the further I read into it the more confused I got. 

Why things can't be explained in laymans terms I dunno... like not everybody's a freaking expert, are they?

 

I only have a 10 metre ethernet lead running upstairs to my entertainment area and devices in question, so that's well under the 90 - 100 metre limit.  It looks like, then, this Netgear network switch will do the job just fine.

Thing is, I do have wi-fi networking available, and I use that for tablets and laptops, etc, but the TV, Bluray player and PVR each require a wired network connection.  The media player is wireless capable but there can be some data loss/disruption when streaming content to it wirelessly, and the wired switch solves all my network problems at once.  I don't know that I need more than 8 ports, but it's good to know that I can cascade hubs if/when necessary

Anyhow, thanks again for the info and prompt response.

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March 25, 2013 7:21:00 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

as far as ip addresses go, there is two ways to set them up

1 (EASY way) let modem/server use Dynamic Host Configuration Protocol (dhcp) administered in modem/server in a (usually) single page with a address range

 

2 (HARD way) MANUALLY configure EACH of the devices with a static(manually configured) address with the server address also specified, and if you add another device you MUST give the new device an address that is NOT used, but in the SAME address range as the modem/server and other devices.

also it is a good idea for windows computers that you want to be able to share printers/files between to (each computer has a different name (like IP addresses)) but the same work(home)group name (same as ip address ranges)

harpo

 

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March 25, 2013 7:29:59 PM from WinCustomize Forums WinCustomize Forums

Yeah, I think I'll let DHCP do it the easy way... hard looks too complicated after pulling yet another all-nighter.

The two main PCs will be the only ones sharing a printer, and that is already set up to go in the home network

Again, thanks for the help... though I'm going for a bit of snooze before putting it to good use.

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March 26, 2013 3:33:44 AM from WinCustomize Forums WinCustomize Forums

Sounds like you got a rockin' set up starkers. If I ever get to Oz I wanna come play at your house.

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March 26, 2013 4:50:40 AM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

starkers is only using 10/100, I have been using 10/100/1000 for several years which helps with the file transfers between comps, and also will NOT need to be upgraded for the nbn (which ever century it happens in( I live in one of the many areas that are NOT even listed for the next three years schedule so have to make do with mere 8mbit adsl))

harpo

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March 26, 2013 5:26:29 AM from WinCustomize Forums WinCustomize Forums

Quoting Uvah,
Sounds like you got a rockin' set up starkers.

It came to me in an epiphany that I've got these networking bits n' pieces laying around gathering dust and I ought to make use of them or turf 'em out.  Well I'm not one for tossing stuff if there's a half a chance it could be useful, like it'd be a long time gone, so I figured connecting up my media devices would be a good move and help keep me off the streets for a while.

Quoting Uvah,
If I ever get to Oz I wanna come play at your house.

Well if you ever get here there'll be a bed for you.  It'll be in the psych ward but not to worry, I sneak out all the time.... only go back for the pills and shock therapy.

They're coming to take me away ho ho, he he, ha ha....

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March 26, 2013 6:59:34 AM from WinCustomize Forums WinCustomize Forums

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March 30, 2013 5:54:23 AM from WinCustomize Forums WinCustomize Forums

Hehe, Jafo, you didn't think anybody 'd recognise you, did you? 

Yup, that's you at 1.09, bush bashing in your pink undies.... can just make out the JAFO tatt on the shoulder.

Anyhow, now I've had a giggle, back to what I was going to ask the wise folk around these here parts...

Okay, so I have a spare Netgear DG834G Router and I want to know if I could use it as another access point/uplink by connecting the in port to an out port on my net connected router... and if so, are there any settings I'd need to make?

I tried searching on the net again but most of what I found were forums and a lot of conflicting answers to the same or similar questions.  Some people said DCHP had to be disabled, others disagreed, and various ones said no settings were necessary if it was being used just as a straight through hub/distribution point to other devices, that those would be assigned IP addresses by the router via DCHP.

If anyone could answer this I'd be most grateful.  Being I have an upstairs downstairs setup, and the 8 port hub is upstairs, I need a couple of extra outlets downstairs so I can get on the net and activate rigs I've just built, etc.

TIA.

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March 30, 2013 10:04:47 AM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

I had an older router I had to manually set the IPs to match the 1st router but I think any modern router is basically plug and play so to say. I would just keep the computer/s you do surfing and DLing the most the shortest route from the modem and router, run the extension to the TVs and such from there.

Do you know how to log in to your routers to access their settings pages? 
I would just do a test plugin , modem ---> routerA ---> routerB ---> computerB, if you got internet you should be able to plug everything else in . If not, maybe we need to set your IP ranges, some brands of router use different ones by default, log into routerB with compterB ,If your router is 192.168.0.0 and its range is 192.168.0.1 to 192.168.0.100 I might try routerA 192.168.0.1 to 192.168.0.10 and routerB 192.168.0.11 to 192.168.0.20 or something like that.

Confused yet 

Or you can pack it all up, send it to Canada and I will be glad to connect it all for you.   

 

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March 30, 2013 2:02:24 PM from Stardock Forums Stardock Forums

 

starkers,

If you have a spare 'router' and you want to use the four ports on it as a simple 'pass-through' switch (instead of going and buying just a switch) you'll need to disable 'network address translation' (what the router does by default).  Some routers have an option to 'disable NAT', others have an option to set the router to 'Bridge mode'.  Either of those options does the same thing.  It stops the router from performing network address translation (which you want OFF if all you care about is extending/passing through a connection to an existing router.

In any case, if your router doesn't allow for 'Bridge mode' or "NAT off' etc. then you really should just get a regular 5-port switch because having a second router on your network (cascading-NAT or double-NAT) is something of an advanced setup and can present some challenges if you're not familiar with how things work.

 

When you disable NAT on a router or set it to 'bridge mode' (same thing) you are essentially (in layman's terms) telling the router to stop doing it's main job.  That is what you need in your situation since all you want that 'router' to do is to be a switch for you.  That is how you solve your issue, whether or not your router let's you do that (some older SOHO routers don't) is another thing. 

 

Here is how I would do things.

 

1.  Log in to the older router and turn NAT off (ie. enable Bridge Mode)

2.  Connect the WAN port on the now 'bridge mode' router to one of the four existing ports on your main router

3.  connect your other devices to one of the 4 other ports (with your repurposed router set to 'bridge mode' they will grab an IP address from your other router)

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March 30, 2013 2:38:31 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

If you do end up needing a switch, I've had very good luck with these: http://www.amazon.com/TRENDnet-Unmanaged-GREENnet-Standard-1000Mbps/dp/B001QUA6RA/ref=wl_it_dp_o_pdT1_nS_nC?ie=UTF8&colid=Y21RYO2GYYC9&coliid=I2VFJP0Z1EWKKP

 

Using two at work and one at home right now. All working without a hiccup for quite a while now. Which is more than I can say for my D-Link gamers lounge router at home, grrrr, have to restart that thing like once a week, or else it just starts dropping wireless connections, wired do stay up running fine though.

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March 30, 2013 2:54:38 PM from Stardock Forums Stardock Forums

Quoting Leo in WI,

Using two at work and one at home right now. All working without a hiccup for quite a while now. Which is more than I can say for my D-Link gamers lounge router at home, grrrr, have to restart that thing like once a week, or else it just starts dropping wireless connections, wired do stay up running fine though.

the dgl 4500?  yeah they have issues with the WISH function as I understand it....using mine now cause it seems like it performs better than my asus rt-n56u...

...huh?  either I'm very confused or the n56u is another piece of awesome hardware with terrible firmware

stupid networking.  I hope the bufferbloat projects have some major impact in the next few years.

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March 30, 2013 5:46:47 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

starkers, the old Netgear DG834G Router/modem will be a problem due to the built-in modem tending to block the use as a bridge/router for a network.

personally I would keep it a spare for when the current modem dies.

harpo

 

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March 30, 2013 9:12:41 PM from JoeUser Forums JoeUser Forums

16 or 24 port switches are not that expensive.  Would run one ethernet cable from your router up to your entertainment room, connect it to the 16-24 port switch (usually to port 1) and connect each of your ethernet devices to remaining available ports.  Let your router do the IP addresses (DHCP) and you should be good to go.  Here's an example.

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April 1, 2013 1:44:06 PM from WinCustomize Forums WinCustomize Forums

Thanks for the replies, folks, I appreciate it...  I've gained some useful information

Anyhow, seeing as the Netgear DG834G is likely to be a problem for its intended use, I have decided to purchase another 8 port switch for downstairs.  I mean, it's only 25 bucks and no trouble to configure. 

I set up the wireless range extender so we can use our tablets and phones upstairs at the other end of the house and we're constantly getting 4 - 5 bars, whereas before we were lucky to get 2 or 3.  That is a big improvement.

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April 1, 2013 5:39:34 PM from JoeUser Forums JoeUser Forums

Glad you're good to go, NORAD. 

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April 5, 2013 4:02:05 PM from JoeUser Forums JoeUser Forums

I see that most have answered your direct questions, I will throw some more things out there for you.

 

Instead of running wires all over the place (My wife made me pick up all my wires), look at using existing wires to connect to your hub/switch or wireless.

 

Wireless you can buy a wireless bridge that a wire form the TV runs to and then connects wirelessly to your WAP.  (so the bridge sits next to your TV)  Not bad if they are in close proximity (wireless signals lose strength fast).

 

Or try Powerline Ethernet.  Use your electrical system to carry the signals.  The initial cost of that is a bit more than the wireless bridge (given you have to buy 2 initially), but if you have 3 or more devices to connect (and do not want to run wires), it becomes very economical.

 

The best thing is most of these things are dumb - which means plug and play.  At worse, you have to connect the bridge to your WAP much the way you would any other device.  But they basically are just dumb forwarders to your intelligent device.

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April 5, 2013 7:50:39 PM from WinCustomize Forums WinCustomize Forums

Get a WD Livewire setup, same as Powerline. Amazon has it for 60USD. Hook it up to your main router and plug it into the wall electric socket. Hook the second unit (it comes with 2)into the plug and run up to 4 eithernet cables  to whatever you want to hook up. I've got 3 sets of these in my house and they work great. No set up, just plug it in.

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April 6, 2013 3:26:50 AM from WinCustomize Forums WinCustomize Forums

Quoting Dr Guy,

I see that most have answered your direct questions, I will throw some more things out there for you.

 

Instead of running wires all over the place (My wife made me pick up all my wires), look at using existing wires to connect to your hub/switch or wireless.

 

Wireless you can buy a wireless bridge that a wire form the TV runs to and then connects wirelessly to your WAP.  (so the bridge sits next to your TV)  Not bad if they are in close proximity (wireless signals lose strength fast).

 

Or try Powerline Ethernet.  Use your electrical system to carry the signals.  The initial cost of that is a bit more than the wireless bridge (given you have to buy 2 initially), but if you have 3 or more devices to connect (and do not want to run wires), it becomes very economical.

 

The best thing is most of these things are dumb - which means plug and play.  At worse, you have to connect the bridge to your WAP much the way you would any other device.  But they basically are just dumb forwarders to your intelligent device.

Thanks Dr G.  I do have a wireless extender for in the bedrooms, where signals were weak and wired connections would have been a problem with tripping and such.

For the TV and media player, however, I prefer a wired connection for video streaming from downstairs, given that wireless signals can break up, etc.  The cable running from the router is pretty much concealed and emerges just behind the entertainment unit, so it is not an eyesore or a tripping hazard and provides good, strong signals to my upstairs devices.

Essentially, then, I have my home network up and running, and at little expense, too... a 10m cable and a wired extender = 35 bucks. I already had the rest laying around... I fix their rigs so family and friends bring me stuff they no longer want or need.

Quoting Kinger,

Get a WD Livewire setup, same as Powerline. Amazon has it for 60USD. Hook it up to your main router and plug it into the wall electric socket. Hook the second unit (it comes with 2)into the plug and run up to 4 eithernet cables  to whatever you want to hook up. I've got 3 sets of these in my house and they work great. No set up, just plug it in.

I looked into the WD Livewire setup and thought it a good idea, but I already had most of what I needed so couldn't justify the cost at this time.  However, it will be  consideration if I ever need to upgrade the network

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April 6, 2013 3:55:39 AM from WinCustomize Forums WinCustomize Forums

Cheaper is always a better solution as long as it works.

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